Diane Warren is in an elite club. Her 13th Oscar nomination in the Best Original Song category puts her among some of the greatest songwriters of all time. Sammy Cahn (23 nominations), Johnny Mercer (18 nods), Alan Menken (14 nominations), and even Randy Newman (13 nominations). In fact, she’s been recognized by her peers in the Academy more than legends such as Henry Mancini (11 nods), Burt Bacharach (5 nods), or Elton John (4 nods), among others. But besides the fact she’s the only woman in the group (historic in its own right), she’s unfortunately also the only one who hasn’t taken home a trophy yet.
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Jumping on the phone the day after the Oscar Luncheon, Warren says she was thrilled to earn another nod for “Somehow You Do” a Reba McEntire sung ballad from the Rodrigo Garcia directed drama “Four Good Days.” Will she finally win a coveted Oscar statue? Well, anything is possible when it comes to The Academy, but she faces tough competition from fellow nominees Billie Eilish and Finneas O’Connell’s “No Time To Die,” Beyonce and Dixon’s “Be Alive” from “King Richard,” and Lin-Manuel Miranda’s “Dos Oruguitas” from “Encanto.” She knows how competitive it is to even land a nomination and the consistent recognition from her peers may just be the biggest win of all.
“It’s the hugest win ever. I’ve already won,” Warren says. “Of course, I’d love to win an Oscar, but how many song categories do the Grammys have? What, 20? 30? The Academy Awards have one. They have five songs, there are hundreds and hundreds of movies and songs every year. The people within the music branch are the greats. They’re the best composers on the planet. They’re the best songwriters on the planet. They’re going to choose five songs. Are you kidding me? If they choose my song, that’s a giant, huge win. And this year especially. I can’t remember a year as competitive as this, with such big movies and big artists doing songs. Then here I am in a smaller film without a giant studio backing it. It’s like the little engine that could, and I stay up all night waiting for those nominations, and I count down the hours and the minutes until they’re announced. I was by no means a slam dunk this year. There was a lot of competition. When they read the nominations, I was having a heart attack, and my song was the last one, so I was jumping up and down. I don’t take any of that for granted. I thought, ‘Yeah, I’ve already won.’ I got chosen by the best, whether I win or not.”
After a breath, she adds, “But that being said, I’d like to win.”
Over the course of our conversation, Warren discusses her pandemic inspiration for the song, the William Shatner connection, what makes a hit song, and much more.
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The Playlist: How was the Oscars luncheon yesterday?
Diane Warren: You know what? It was really amazing. I have to say, I’ve been to a bunch and they’re always great because it’s just kind of a day of celebrating your peers and all the nominees. So, it’s always an amazing day because fast forward to three weeks later, and four out of the five of those people are going to be bummed, but for that one day? No, but it’s always really fun and I think also because of the last couple of years where we couldn’t do this. Everything’s on Zoom or it was virtual. I was at the last year’s Oscars and there was no lunch, so we didn’t even get a chance. There was a real joy, it felt very electric in there.
Oh, that’s fantastic.
And I might add, they should have [show producer] Will Packer be one of the hosts because he was awesome.
Oh, well, you never know what’s going to happen. People are still getting COVID, it could happen. He might have to step in. I’m joking obviously.
No, he was great. He did his speech, at the lunch and he spoke and he was funny. He should be a standup comedian or a host.
Well, you were nominated last year as well for “Seen “From The Life Ahead,” but I was reading up on “Somehow You Do” which is from “Four Good Days” which I’d forgotten premiered at the 2020 Sundance Film Festival. Did you write this song before “Seen”?
No, no, no. I wrote it after “Seen.” I wrote it right when the shutdown happened. I’d seen the movie right before, right at that same time. It was like a year after or two years, whatever, whenever I wrote “Seen.” It was definitely after.
Was it something that was added to the film after its Sundance debut?
My friend Bonnie Abaunza told me about the movie. Yeah, it had to be after Sundance, yeah. For sure. The song wasn’t in it in Sundance.
Do you remember what your inspiration was for the song? Did Rodrigo or the producers have any thoughts about what they were looking for? Or did they just ask you to watch the film and get your immediate feedback?
It’s more that, because usually, someone doesn’t tell me what to write, because usually I read a script or I see something, then I’ll kind of get inspired and then I’ll play it for somebody. This was a case like that where I saw the movie, and the story really moved me. Opioid addiction is like another pandemic in this country.
It definitely is.
This was a true story, this movie, and most of these stories don’t end well. They end in overdoses and death, sadly, and this one did have a happy ending. It had a happy ending because she lived and she overcame it. But I wanted to write a hopeful song. Like you think the mountain’s too high and the ocean’s too wide and, and you’ll never get through. Someway, somehow you do. You think that you can’t do it, but you can [even] when it feels like everything’s against you. Now, I wrote it right at the beginning of the shutdown and the pandemic, and that layer came into that song because as I was writing, I’m going, “God, this is not only fitting the story of this movie but it’s fitting what’s happening in real life, in real-time.” It’s pretty dark.
For sure.
But no matter how long the night is, the day does come. I wanted to write a hopeful song for the movie, and then it started resonating with people. I would look at the comments on Reba McEntire‘s video and just see that, wow, this song’s getting people through a lot of stuff. A lot of mental health stuff, and not just addiction. It was taking on other meanings, as well.
I know the song isn’t inherently a “country song,” but obviously Reba brings something to it that makes it seem that way. Was that an idea that was going through your mind while you were writing it, or is that just something that comes along further down in the process?
O.K., so here’s the thing. This song is a very open song. Anybody could do it, because what I do is I cast the artist for whatever movie I’m doing, that artist has to be authentic to the movie.
Right.
It can’t just be an artist thrown on. Even if it’s an end song, it has to be authentic. First of all, Reba McEntire emanates resilience and strength and being a survivor. She represents that, and you can hear it in her voice. Vocally, it’s in every note she sings. She has that, so I thought, “O.K. she’s the perfect [vocalist].” It’s not a country song per se, but I thought, “Reba, God. She could just sing the s**t out of this song, and she’s going to feel every note, and she’s going to portray the emotion and power of that song.” And, I could imagine Glenn Close‘s character playing Reba McEntire records.
Yeah.
I could imagine Reba McEntire in that movie. In that case, that artist, she’s the right artist for that song and the right artist for that movie. When you have that, it’s a great thing. Of course, William Shatner did a spoken-word version, and that is a totally different thing. It’s cool to hear how your song can live.
Wait, I didn’t even know about this. Shatner did a version? Was it after the movie came out?
Yeah, yeah. He has a show called “I Don’t Understand,” where he has different people on to explain things to him, and he wanted me to be on an episode called “What Makes A Hit Song.” I’d heard his version of “Rocket Man,” his spoken-word version, and I thought, “You know what? I want to get him to do a spoken word version of “Somehow You Do.” It’s on YouTube, you should check it out. It’s great. It’s also a mashup. You should check the mashup of Reba McEntire and William Shatner, too.
I will immediately go to YouTube and search for all of this.
It’s really cool, and he was really a good sport. I kind of snipered him. I brought my engineer and some recording equipment and said, “Hey, you feel like doing it? Do you want to know what makes a hit? Let’s make this a hit.” There I was, directing William Shatner, and it’s fantastic because it’s different from Reba, but he’s speaking the words. It’s almost like he makes you feel like your going to be O.K. as well.
Now that you brought the subject up, I have to ask in the shortest answer possible, what is your de facto answer to what makes a hit song?
It starts with a great song. I mean, there’s a lot of elements that have to go into it. The song has to be a hit, A. B, it has to find the right artist. C, it has to be promoted and the label has to get behind it, or it has to have a machine behind it to get on all the playlists and get on the radio. There’s a lot that goes into it. My job is I have to write something that sounds like a hit or write a great song. I can only do what I do.
And you have done it so well. So many of your Oscars songs have been hits for the artists that they’ve been associated with. “Seen,” for Laura Pausini last year. Even the music video for “Somehow You Do” is over one million views. Forget about how the movie does, do you get satisfaction from just the success that the songs have just on the music side of the business?
Yeah, because these songs really go deep with people, some of these songs. When you mentioned “Seen,” people really love that song, and if you go on YouTube there are so many covers, and so many people have recorded it. That’s kind of a song that’s, I think, going to be what we call a copyright, a lasting song. Then other songs, like “Til It Happens to You” that I wrote for Lady Gaga, was a documentary on college sexual assault but the song went beyond it. It really helped the Me Too movement. No one was talking about it at that time. Nobody talked about sexual assault and molestation and stuff like that. Not in the way since after that, and I feel like that song had a really powerful impact. Things like that, or “Stand Up For Something,” which became a protest anthem after it was in “Marshall.” These songs, the fact that they live on is great. That’s what I want to do. I want to write songs that live on.
I think that’s an understatement that you’ve done that, but this is your 13th nomination, you have not won yet. I believe you will win someday, but does just the fact that you’ve been recognized so often by the branch mean anything to you?
Are you kidding me? It’s the hugest win ever. I’ve already won. Of course, I’d love to win an Oscar, but how many song categories do the Grammys have? What, 20? 30? The Academy Awards have one. They have five songs, there are hundreds and hundreds of movies and songs every year. The people within the music branch are the greats. They’re the best composers on the planet. They’re the best songwriters on the planet. They’re going to choose five songs. Are you kidding me? If they choose my song, that’s a giant, huge win. And this year especially. I can’t remember a year as competitive as this, with such big movies and big artists doing songs. Then here I am in a smaller film without a giant studio backing it. It’s like the little engine that could, and I stay up all night waiting for those nominations, and I count down the hours and the minutes until they’re announced. I was by no means a slam dunk this year. There was a lot of competition. When they read the nominations, I was having a heart attack, and my song was the last one, so I was jumping up and down. I don’t take any of that for granted. I thought, “Yeah, I’ve already won.” I got chosen by the best, whether I win or not. But that being said, I’d like to win.
And hey, a lot of people would like you to win.
Thank you. I’m feeling that. It’s almost like I’m a sports team or something that’s gone decades without winning the Super Bowl or something. I mean, my first nomination was in 1988, so it was 34 years ago. It’s something like that, I guess.
My last question for you is about whether Reba will be performing the song during the Oscars. Do we know if that’s happening?
I don’t know yet. Look at the stars, look at the artists they have. I’d hope so. I hope all the performers are performing. I’m sure we’ll know soon. I’m sure they’ll announce it soon if that’s happening.