Filmmaker James Mangold’s “Indiana Jones And The Dial Of Destiny” is in theaters now, and while it seemed to underwhelm at the global box office in its opening weekend, the film has grossed $305 million worldwide so far, so maybe there’s hope it can have some minor legs. If anything, it maybe shows how making a blockbuster with an 80-year-old star can only take you so far with audiences. Still, Mangold is seemingly undeterred about anything and has three films in the works. A Bob Dylan film starring Timothée Chalamet is shooting soon, a DC “Swamp Thing” project, and a “Dawn Of The Jedi” (unofficial fan title essentially) “Star Wars” movie about the creation of the Jedi some thousands of years before “Star Wars: A New Hope.”
In a recent Happy Sad Confused podcast chat, however, Mangold pulled back the curtain a little bit. Interestingly, while he was the one that pitched a “Dawn of the Jedi” film, something he has described as akin to “The Ten Commandments,” he himself had no clue exactly when that took place in the “Star Wars” timeline, and he had to engage with the sages at Lucasfilm to get the exact date.
“When I talked to some of the Star Wars clerics who keep track of all these timelines, I was like, ‘so when would this have happened?’ And they were like, ‘25,000 years before ‘Episode I,’” he explained. “And I was like, ‘I was looking for some distance, but that’s distance. I might find Charlton Heston in an abandoned subway station with Apes, but I’ll do it!”
Mangold has obviously done a lot of franchise work, but it’s always been from a different angle. “Logan” was an R-Rated look at an aging Wolverine, and ‘Dial Of Destiny’ for Mangold was also an opportunity to explore a heroic figure staring down the last chapter of his life. Similarly, the appeal of “Star Wars,” he said— or at least the version he is envisioning— is that it’s much different from the rest of the George Lucas-created canon, and given it’ll be the earliest film in the timeline, it’ll give him plenty of freedom to be its own thing and not have to worry about much Easter Eggs, winks or fan service.
“The reality for me was that feeling of space, no pun intended, but it was something I felt was really important,” he explained.” [It’s] not to get away from fan service or the intricacies of what George Lucas had set up and dreamed up, but just have the space to tell a story and not be instantly encumbered with all the bases you have to hit. Honestly, there’s no way to explain it to folks other than to say that it’s like that game Twister. At a certain point, you’re in a tangle, and just cause you’re trying to find a way to tell a story with so many constraints that you can’t.”
Mangold said he hasn’t talked to Lucas at all about ‘Star Wars,’ but did talk to him about ‘Dial Of Destiny’ and that Lucas was apparently a big fan of “Ford and Ferrari.” Would he talk to Lucas about it, sure, but he suggested he would only do so when he had a stronger, more clear-cut idea of what he was making and what kind of script and story he was telling.
“I like to have my shit together before I get into those kinds of situations because every good idea skates at the very edge of being precipitously awful, and every safe idea never gets toward that end,” he said. “So the trick is that develop your idea enough so that your compatriots and consultants and mentors can understand how you’re going to avoid going over the edge, not just daring it. So obviously, as a writer, I am on strike right now, so those solutions and that process is not going to happen right now”
Asked whether we’d hear the words “Jedi” and “midichlorians” in the film, Mangold said he wouldn’t commit to it but noted that his film is very much before the creation of the Jedi order, before the formation of Jedis, so it’s very very nascent.
“I don’t want to make any guarantees one way or another, but it’ll be before Jedi [exist],” he said. “Meaning, you might be experiencing something that might become Jedi.. but, despite the fact that some people make movies other ways, I don’t think people tend to brand themselves before they’ve found themselves. You don’t come up with a name for your organization… I tend to think that the branding happens later.”
That’s all he would share, but the revelation that we may see a film that doesn’t even feature Jedi but could include warriors who will one day become Jedis or become leaders that form the Jedi order is pretty fascinating to hear. Check out the full Happy Sad Confused podcast below.
